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	<title>Comments on: Why &#8220;Work Like a Patron Day&#8221; won&#8217;t work</title>
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	<link>http://www.tararobertson.ca/blog/2008/why-work-like-a-patron-day-wont-work/</link>
	<description>amateur systems librarian</description>
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		<title>By: martha</title>
		<link>http://www.tararobertson.ca/blog/2008/why-work-like-a-patron-day-wont-work/comment-page-1/#comment-296</link>
		<dc:creator>martha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 21:14:28 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>WLaPD? I am sorry, but I see this as nothing but a nice gesture with little substance and even less benefits. I completely agree with Tara; it is fundamentally flawed. It is assuming that patrons and staff needs, skills, abilities and knowledge are the same. They are certainly not!

- use the public computers to do your work: exactly how would I be able to my job when the public computers do not have access to the staff servers, staff version of the ILS and my files? In order to find out the problems or limitations of the public computers, I would have to attempt to emulate what I would need as a patron or even better, I could actually ask patrons (or potential patrons) what kind of problems they have with the computers.

- reserve public meeting rooms for meetings: as with every other suggestion for WLaPD, as library staff, most probably I know how to reserver these rooms, since I probably had to help people with it, so exactly, what would I gain by doing the reservation?

- follow all library policies: aren&#039;t we supposed to this on a regular basis?

- sit in the chairs/use the furniture meant for the public: OK, this might work... although, of course, that would assume that we have diverse enough staff that accurately represents patrons.

- use only the patron interface for searching your catalog: err... I don&#039;t how they do things at your libraries, but at every single library I&#039;ve worked, library staff assisting patrons, tend to use the OPAC. Also important to point out, I would not be able to do many of the tasks that I need to do everyday by using the public interface and, believe me, this is not what is wrong with it. Staff and patrons have different needs.

- pay your library fines (no waiving them the day before!): why only on WLaPD? Shouldn&#039;t we always be held to the same standard as our patrons?

- use a database you’ve never used before: for those of us working in reference, this is a regular occurance and it will not reflect the kind of problems our patrons face.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>WLaPD? I am sorry, but I see this as nothing but a nice gesture with little substance and even less benefits. I completely agree with Tara; it is fundamentally flawed. It is assuming that patrons and staff needs, skills, abilities and knowledge are the same. They are certainly not!</p>
<p>- use the public computers to do your work: exactly how would I be able to my job when the public computers do not have access to the staff servers, staff version of the ILS and my files? In order to find out the problems or limitations of the public computers, I would have to attempt to emulate what I would need as a patron or even better, I could actually ask patrons (or potential patrons) what kind of problems they have with the computers.</p>
<p>- reserve public meeting rooms for meetings: as with every other suggestion for WLaPD, as library staff, most probably I know how to reserver these rooms, since I probably had to help people with it, so exactly, what would I gain by doing the reservation?</p>
<p>- follow all library policies: aren&#8217;t we supposed to this on a regular basis?</p>
<p>- sit in the chairs/use the furniture meant for the public: OK, this might work&#8230; although, of course, that would assume that we have diverse enough staff that accurately represents patrons.</p>
<p>- use only the patron interface for searching your catalog: err&#8230; I don&#8217;t how they do things at your libraries, but at every single library I&#8217;ve worked, library staff assisting patrons, tend to use the OPAC. Also important to point out, I would not be able to do many of the tasks that I need to do everyday by using the public interface and, believe me, this is not what is wrong with it. Staff and patrons have different needs.</p>
<p>- pay your library fines (no waiving them the day before!): why only on WLaPD? Shouldn&#8217;t we always be held to the same standard as our patrons?</p>
<p>- use a database you’ve never used before: for those of us working in reference, this is a regular occurance and it will not reflect the kind of problems our patrons face.</p>
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		<title>By: tara</title>
		<link>http://www.tararobertson.ca/blog/2008/why-work-like-a-patron-day-wont-work/comment-page-1/#comment-267</link>
		<dc:creator>tara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Dec 2008 21:34:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tararobertson.ca/?p=1369#comment-267</guid>
		<description>Thanks for weighing in Brian.  

I think, at least in a public library setting, that non users are still patrons, so I&#039;m not quite sure that &quot;Live Like a non-Patron&quot; is correct.  It&#039;s easy to keep giving the people who are currently using the library more of the same (though I appreciate that&#039;s not what WLAP Day is).  I think the more challenging, and critical task is to broaden our base of users.  

Point taken that WLAP Day and community development are different approaches.  I&#039;m just afraid that a library would do WLAP Day, take some photos, dust off their hands and say, &quot;Well, that&#039;s it!  We now know what our library is like for our patrons.&quot;  The critical discussion and the policy piece that gets developed afterward is where I see the real potential.  

I&#039;ve also heard WLAP Day referred to as Library 2.0, which kinda bugs me.  But that&#039;s another thread entirely...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for weighing in Brian.  </p>
<p>I think, at least in a public library setting, that non users are still patrons, so I&#8217;m not quite sure that &#8220;Live Like a non-Patron&#8221; is correct.  It&#8217;s easy to keep giving the people who are currently using the library more of the same (though I appreciate that&#8217;s not what WLAP Day is).  I think the more challenging, and critical task is to broaden our base of users.  </p>
<p>Point taken that WLAP Day and community development are different approaches.  I&#8217;m just afraid that a library would do WLAP Day, take some photos, dust off their hands and say, &#8220;Well, that&#8217;s it!  We now know what our library is like for our patrons.&#8221;  The critical discussion and the policy piece that gets developed afterward is where I see the real potential.  </p>
<p>I&#8217;ve also heard WLAP Day referred to as Library 2.0, which kinda bugs me.  But that&#8217;s another thread entirely&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Stephens</title>
		<link>http://www.tararobertson.ca/blog/2008/why-work-like-a-patron-day-wont-work/comment-page-1/#comment-266</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Stephens</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Dec 2008 21:31:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tararobertson.ca/?p=1369#comment-266</guid>
		<description>I agree with Aaron and Brian. 

I was drawn to WLaPD because it emphasized something we sometimes forget: looking beyond our desks and the comfortable worlds we&#039;ve build in our libraries to see what policies, physical barriers and spaces might impeded current users in our libraries.

In talk, I call it having &quot;new eyes&quot; or &quot;user&#039;s eyes.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with Aaron and Brian. </p>
<p>I was drawn to WLaPD because it emphasized something we sometimes forget: looking beyond our desks and the comfortable worlds we&#8217;ve build in our libraries to see what policies, physical barriers and spaces might impeded current users in our libraries.</p>
<p>In talk, I call it having &#8220;new eyes&#8221; or &#8220;user&#8217;s eyes.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Brian Herzog</title>
		<link>http://www.tararobertson.ca/blog/2008/why-work-like-a-patron-day-wont-work/comment-page-1/#comment-265</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian Herzog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Dec 2008 21:16:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tararobertson.ca/?p=1369#comment-265</guid>
		<description>I think Aaron summarized WLAP day accurately - it was mainly an idea of how to get staff to experience what it&#039;s like to actually use the tools and services offered in the library.  The point was to take a look at what we are doing, and make sure we&#039;re doing it in a way that meets patron need.  

The fact WLAP Day doesn&#039;t address people who aren&#039;t coming into the library shouldn&#039;t automatically discredit it.  Finding out why people don&#039;t come to the library is a complex and long-term undertaking that is important and shouldn&#039;t be taken lightly.  WLAP Day is something staff can do anytime, at no cost.  I think they are two different things, and are not mutually exclusive.

In fact, the very name, &quot;Work Like a Patron,&quot; identifies that it focuses on people who are patrons; who are coming into the library.  Your idea is much more broad in scope, and sounds more like &quot;Live Like a non-Patron.&quot;  An initiative like that would need to be a coordinated effort at many levels of the library and community, and, while resource-intensive, would greatly benefit a library.  And I am all for it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think Aaron summarized WLAP day accurately &#8211; it was mainly an idea of how to get staff to experience what it&#8217;s like to actually use the tools and services offered in the library.  The point was to take a look at what we are doing, and make sure we&#8217;re doing it in a way that meets patron need.  </p>
<p>The fact WLAP Day doesn&#8217;t address people who aren&#8217;t coming into the library shouldn&#8217;t automatically discredit it.  Finding out why people don&#8217;t come to the library is a complex and long-term undertaking that is important and shouldn&#8217;t be taken lightly.  WLAP Day is something staff can do anytime, at no cost.  I think they are two different things, and are not mutually exclusive.</p>
<p>In fact, the very name, &#8220;Work Like a Patron,&#8221; identifies that it focuses on people who are patrons; who are coming into the library.  Your idea is much more broad in scope, and sounds more like &#8220;Live Like a non-Patron.&#8221;  An initiative like that would need to be a coordinated effort at many levels of the library and community, and, while resource-intensive, would greatly benefit a library.  And I am all for it.</p>
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		<title>By: tara</title>
		<link>http://www.tararobertson.ca/blog/2008/why-work-like-a-patron-day-wont-work/comment-page-1/#comment-264</link>
		<dc:creator>tara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Dec 2008 20:51:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tararobertson.ca/?p=1369#comment-264</guid>
		<description>Thanks Aaron for clarifying that it&#039;s Herzog&#039;s idea--sorry about that.

I can see how this could be a baby step in the right direction, however I suspect many libraries would do this exercise and the process would end there.  

More effective than us pretending to be the public for an afternoon, would be for us to engage the public (including non-users) in an honest dialogue where we would listen to what the community is saying.  

In the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.librariesincommunities.ca/resources/Community-Led_Libraries_Toolkit.pdf&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Community Led Libraries Toolkit&lt;/a&gt;, a community librarian reports some of the concerns that street involved youth and some men recently released from federal prison had about the library security gates:  &quot;They asked “will the metal from body piercings set off the alarm?”... “What about a can of pepper spray or a knife?”... “How about a heavy chain belt?” People talked about being embarrassed if the gates went off and worse, wanted to know if they would be searched. If so, will staff find the joint in the back pocket resulting in an arrest for possession? All these questions and concerns about the security gates made the library seem like a risky place.&quot;

Most librarians (and others who work in the library) wouldn&#039;t ever imagine that the security gates could be perceived in this way.  And we would never learn that some of our patrons perceive this unless we build relationships with people, talk, and most importantly listen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Aaron for clarifying that it&#8217;s Herzog&#8217;s idea&#8211;sorry about that.</p>
<p>I can see how this could be a baby step in the right direction, however I suspect many libraries would do this exercise and the process would end there.  </p>
<p>More effective than us pretending to be the public for an afternoon, would be for us to engage the public (including non-users) in an honest dialogue where we would listen to what the community is saying.  </p>
<p>In the <a href="http://www.librariesincommunities.ca/resources/Community-Led_Libraries_Toolkit.pdf" rel="nofollow">Community Led Libraries Toolkit</a>, a community librarian reports some of the concerns that street involved youth and some men recently released from federal prison had about the library security gates:  &#8220;They asked “will the metal from body piercings set off the alarm?”&#8230; “What about a can of pepper spray or a knife?”&#8230; “How about a heavy chain belt?” People talked about being embarrassed if the gates went off and worse, wanted to know if they would be searched. If so, will staff find the joint in the back pocket resulting in an arrest for possession? All these questions and concerns about the security gates made the library seem like a risky place.&#8221;</p>
<p>Most librarians (and others who work in the library) wouldn&#8217;t ever imagine that the security gates could be perceived in this way.  And we would never learn that some of our patrons perceive this unless we build relationships with people, talk, and most importantly listen.</p>
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		<title>By: aaron</title>
		<link>http://www.tararobertson.ca/blog/2008/why-work-like-a-patron-day-wont-work/comment-page-1/#comment-263</link>
		<dc:creator>aaron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Dec 2008 20:10:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tararobertson.ca/?p=1369#comment-263</guid>
		<description>While I&#039;ve often advocated for spending time and effort exploring new ways to serve library members in many different ways (and spent the time and effort myself), I didn&#039;t interpret this as the intention of Herzog&#039;s great &quot;Work Like a Patron Day&quot; idea. 

Participating in something like &quot;WLaPD&quot; is perhaps more important and fundamental than implementing some innovative new way to serve people online or in house.  WIthout a solid foundation of extremely usable buildings, services, and websites, libraries are building their future efforts on sinking sand.  

There&#039;s no running before walking, so while I do indeed  think that libraries need to run, there are other things to be addressed before that can happen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While I&#8217;ve often advocated for spending time and effort exploring new ways to serve library members in many different ways (and spent the time and effort myself), I didn&#8217;t interpret this as the intention of Herzog&#8217;s great &#8220;Work Like a Patron Day&#8221; idea. </p>
<p>Participating in something like &#8220;WLaPD&#8221; is perhaps more important and fundamental than implementing some innovative new way to serve people online or in house.  WIthout a solid foundation of extremely usable buildings, services, and websites, libraries are building their future efforts on sinking sand.  </p>
<p>There&#8217;s no running before walking, so while I do indeed  think that libraries need to run, there are other things to be addressed before that can happen.</p>
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